Artist Jonas Ohlsson on Elitism in art
Elitisme in Art!
tuff subject...you don't want to be an elitist do you?
Or maybe you do! We have to define it.
Elitism=The idea that some people are MORE qualified than others to
make judgements. Why is that such a hard idea to swollow in art, whereas I would have NO
problem with the idea that a proffessor in chemistry is more qualified than me to talk about chemistry.
Or that Ronaldhino who is a better footballer than me, could teach me a thing or two about football, or is that another thing!?
I accept that some people know more than me about MANY things and I have noproblem with it.
This problem probably has to do with the idea of Democracy and knowledge. Everybody has a right to vote.
We actually don't assume that people know anything about anything to be able to vote. But at least they know VERY good what their lives look like and what their problems are and that should count for something, so maybe it is like having 16
million elitist experts about their own lives voting about their own lives...is that elitistic?
Elitism also has to do with Joseph Beuys idea that everybody is an artist. The opposite of that is Martin Kippenbergs GREAT, funny reply! "every artist is a Human being"
Am I pro-elitism if I think that it is also about passion and hours that you put in and knowledge.
If you love something , then you are also more qualified to judge it.If you have put in the hours, read books, gone to exhibitons, thought about art, maybe even made art (although that is not necessary according to
curators and art historians, even though I might disagree...or maybe not, they put in OTHER hours than I do...like reading more books than me probably). I am however NOT willing to take shit from people who doesn't even LIKE
or care about art. People who don't care about art but still feels qualified to make judgements. Why would it be so hard to accept that you might actually have to like art to understand it.
It is like a relationship or maybe even love...You get what you give. Or..."if you give...you get it ". Some people understands their wifes paintings or maybe they only likes Andy Warhol but that is not enough. That just basically only gives you the right to talk about your wifes paintings and/or Andy Warhol.This is a problem too with some art students...they often think it is
enough to care about their own art, and of course there ARE loners out there that have come up with great art and music sitting in a hut on a mountain... but those are the exceptions. Not something you would recommend to most people.
Here I can respect some curators or arthistorians that actually LIKES art and read about it and tries to understand things, because they are interested in something other than themselves, something you can sometimes NOT say about certain art students. So maybe it is just about love AGAIN! those who put in time,passion,hours and LOVE are qualified to judge and
for them it would be OK to say that they are the elite, because they have deserved it!!!!
So why would it then be so hard to just tell some people to shut up! or tell them "You just don't know enough about this subject to talk about it".
Why is is so scary for people to have this feeling that they just don't know very much about a certain subject and just accept it.Or maybe it would be nicer to say "You just don't LOVE enough to be able to talk about this subject". I am perfectly willing to shut up about Cricket because I just don't care enough, know enough or love enough to be able to talk about it.
In art for some strange reason EVERYBODY and his grandmother thinks they are qualified to open their mouth.
I don't get it! So am I then against democracy...not really.
People can make which ever art they want (informed and curious...or not) or talk about art in every which way they want.
But just don't come with uniformed BS outside of what you like, know or
care about! And THIS for some strange reason seems to happen in art a lot more often than in say quantum physics.
Of course you have the difference between hard fact proven scientific areas which is result oriented and easy to prove...if a gay guy runs 100 meters faster than another gay guy, then it is actually proven that that gay guy is REALLY faster.
In art, football and many other areas that is much harder to prove. In soft areas, where taste and judgement plays a role things is of course a matter of taste, but then make sure that it is a WELL INFORMED matter of taste and judgement.
Why would that be too much to ask and considerd fascistic and elitistic (in a bad way)?
Democracy again... people vote for the people they thinks can make the best judgements but then those elected people STILL consults the experts. We can vote for who we wants to have as minister of defence,but he or she will still consult experts from clingendael for knowledge and ask people who knows things about that subject. Is that Elitism?
WHY do you have that in art and NOT in other areas. Ok, in football everybody ALSO thinks he is the best coach of the Dutch
national team. Holland- 16 million coaches! But they don't REALLY think that they would know better, they just do it
because it's fun and part of the game. Most people agrees that Lois van Gaal probably knows more than them about coaching. Is it still even proven that some coaches are better than others? yes probably...maybe,...but we can't prove it!
Two coaches never coached the same team under the exact same conditions. Luck is important and football is not a science but about coaching chaos and coincidences.
Why does it have such a bad name...elitisme.
The idea that some know more and are better informed and in a better position to make judgements. So is it then not a good tip to tell people "if you don't love something...you are probably not qualified to judge it?"
Probably not because you would only get a bunch of yes sayers...like having Britney Spears fanclub decide her postion in the history of music... She would probably end up at number one! ...but it is probably a good thing to tell people "If you don't care about something it is probably a good thing to not judge it". Caring being different to liking or loving something...
Can someone who doesn't like something be as well informed as someone who likes it? maybe...but that would be a VERY strange person...why would you spend massive amounts of time and energy (because that is what it takes to
become wellinformed) finding out things about stuff you don't even like. Sounds a bit masochistic.
If I had to choose I would go with the fan or lover for information... even though love is blind it is probably also very well informed. I will just assume that Brad Pitt knows more about Angelina Joline than me although I might not be able to prove it scientifically.
Jonas Ohlsson, Amsterdam 20-02-2007
tuff subject...you don't want to be an elitist do you?
Or maybe you do! We have to define it.
Elitism=The idea that some people are MORE qualified than others to
make judgements. Why is that such a hard idea to swollow in art, whereas I would have NO
problem with the idea that a proffessor in chemistry is more qualified than me to talk about chemistry.
Or that Ronaldhino who is a better footballer than me, could teach me a thing or two about football, or is that another thing!?
I accept that some people know more than me about MANY things and I have noproblem with it.
This problem probably has to do with the idea of Democracy and knowledge. Everybody has a right to vote.
We actually don't assume that people know anything about anything to be able to vote. But at least they know VERY good what their lives look like and what their problems are and that should count for something, so maybe it is like having 16
million elitist experts about their own lives voting about their own lives...is that elitistic?
Elitism also has to do with Joseph Beuys idea that everybody is an artist. The opposite of that is Martin Kippenbergs GREAT, funny reply! "every artist is a Human being"
Am I pro-elitism if I think that it is also about passion and hours that you put in and knowledge.
If you love something , then you are also more qualified to judge it.If you have put in the hours, read books, gone to exhibitons, thought about art, maybe even made art (although that is not necessary according to
curators and art historians, even though I might disagree...or maybe not, they put in OTHER hours than I do...like reading more books than me probably). I am however NOT willing to take shit from people who doesn't even LIKE
or care about art. People who don't care about art but still feels qualified to make judgements. Why would it be so hard to accept that you might actually have to like art to understand it.
It is like a relationship or maybe even love...You get what you give. Or..."if you give...you get it ". Some people understands their wifes paintings or maybe they only likes Andy Warhol but that is not enough. That just basically only gives you the right to talk about your wifes paintings and/or Andy Warhol.This is a problem too with some art students...they often think it is
enough to care about their own art, and of course there ARE loners out there that have come up with great art and music sitting in a hut on a mountain... but those are the exceptions. Not something you would recommend to most people.
Here I can respect some curators or arthistorians that actually LIKES art and read about it and tries to understand things, because they are interested in something other than themselves, something you can sometimes NOT say about certain art students. So maybe it is just about love AGAIN! those who put in time,passion,hours and LOVE are qualified to judge and
for them it would be OK to say that they are the elite, because they have deserved it!!!!
So why would it then be so hard to just tell some people to shut up! or tell them "You just don't know enough about this subject to talk about it".
Why is is so scary for people to have this feeling that they just don't know very much about a certain subject and just accept it.Or maybe it would be nicer to say "You just don't LOVE enough to be able to talk about this subject". I am perfectly willing to shut up about Cricket because I just don't care enough, know enough or love enough to be able to talk about it.
In art for some strange reason EVERYBODY and his grandmother thinks they are qualified to open their mouth.
I don't get it! So am I then against democracy...not really.
People can make which ever art they want (informed and curious...or not) or talk about art in every which way they want.
But just don't come with uniformed BS outside of what you like, know or
care about! And THIS for some strange reason seems to happen in art a lot more often than in say quantum physics.
Of course you have the difference between hard fact proven scientific areas which is result oriented and easy to prove...if a gay guy runs 100 meters faster than another gay guy, then it is actually proven that that gay guy is REALLY faster.
In art, football and many other areas that is much harder to prove. In soft areas, where taste and judgement plays a role things is of course a matter of taste, but then make sure that it is a WELL INFORMED matter of taste and judgement.
Why would that be too much to ask and considerd fascistic and elitistic (in a bad way)?
Democracy again... people vote for the people they thinks can make the best judgements but then those elected people STILL consults the experts. We can vote for who we wants to have as minister of defence,but he or she will still consult experts from clingendael for knowledge and ask people who knows things about that subject. Is that Elitism?
WHY do you have that in art and NOT in other areas. Ok, in football everybody ALSO thinks he is the best coach of the Dutch
national team. Holland- 16 million coaches! But they don't REALLY think that they would know better, they just do it
because it's fun and part of the game. Most people agrees that Lois van Gaal probably knows more than them about coaching. Is it still even proven that some coaches are better than others? yes probably...maybe,...but we can't prove it!
Two coaches never coached the same team under the exact same conditions. Luck is important and football is not a science but about coaching chaos and coincidences.
Why does it have such a bad name...elitisme.
The idea that some know more and are better informed and in a better position to make judgements. So is it then not a good tip to tell people "if you don't love something...you are probably not qualified to judge it?"
Probably not because you would only get a bunch of yes sayers...like having Britney Spears fanclub decide her postion in the history of music... She would probably end up at number one! ...but it is probably a good thing to tell people "If you don't care about something it is probably a good thing to not judge it". Caring being different to liking or loving something...
Can someone who doesn't like something be as well informed as someone who likes it? maybe...but that would be a VERY strange person...why would you spend massive amounts of time and energy (because that is what it takes to
become wellinformed) finding out things about stuff you don't even like. Sounds a bit masochistic.
If I had to choose I would go with the fan or lover for information... even though love is blind it is probably also very well informed. I will just assume that Brad Pitt knows more about Angelina Joline than me although I might not be able to prove it scientifically.
Jonas Ohlsson, Amsterdam 20-02-2007
posted by Peste at 12:01 fm
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